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| Backdooruk |
I like hitting women. 
I expect that most readers will know what I mean by this given the context. However I have known men who like hitting women who most of us would not find admirable. These are the genuine misogynists whose hatred fuels their desire to hurt. In the vanilla word they often turn into abusers, but in the BDSM world they have a ready-made excuse. “Hey, I'm a Dom” or “Hey, I'm just a sadist”.
I bet we've all come across them (and their female equivalents) if not in clubs, certainly in the on-line world. Such people are often not well liked, though they seem to get a share of people to play with. What bothers me though is when they are *tolerated*, when they are not challenged, because their similarity to more ethically based BDSM provides enough camouflage for them to get away with it. It's not just about them fooling a potential partner that they will treat them right, it's about them fooling the rest of us that their behavior, and the ideas they contribute to the scene are untainted by beliefs based on a core of unacceptable assumptions.
We had a discussion in Jaggery's blog about Nazi uniforms as a fetish. Without reprising it, we can all agree (I suspect) that a uniform kink based on real admiration for the death camps, for racial purity or on homophobia is as unacceptable as the core beliefs that the kink is based on.
When I hit a woman, the result is usually more admiration for her as a person and often more intimate feelings for her. If I should lose my dress sense enough to play wearing a Nazi uniform I would expect the result to be similarly positive. The one's we need to condemn are those who *support* their bigotry via BDSM, and we need to condemn them when ever they raise their heads, in what ever form, consistently, whatever that bigotry may be.
- Chris
| 28 Oct 05, 12:43 PM StanBWonderful UK(L), 6 yrs |
OOO, interesting blog Do men who beat women do it because they hate women or do they just lose control? Do the doms/dommes who *claim* to hate subs really hate them, or are they just playing up to what they think dom/dommes should be like? Seems to be that there is a lot of flat world thinking in the BDSM comunity, 'specialy online. Doms/dommes seem powerful/ wonderful/ divine so they are! Subs seem pathetic/ weak/ worthless so they are! I disagreed with you on the nazi uniform thread, but I do agree with you when you say we need to condem those who support bigorty via BDSM, whatever it may be. Angels without wings have to walk Edited 28 Oct 05, 12:51 PM by StanBWonderful | ||
| 28 Oct 05, 12:55 PM Fearchara 6 yrs |
Excellent blog. I foresee two problems with doing as you suggest. Firstly the difficulty of actually spotting people who are using BDSM as an excuse to vent their hatred of whatever sort. To the extent that they are using BDSM as a 'cover' they are hardly likely to turn round and admit their bigotry so that we might condemn them. We are therefore left with trying to spot any indicators that would raise alarm bells. I have, over a period of time, talked a few men whom I decided were using BDSM as an excuse to emotionally belittle / physically hurt women, and I don't mean in a 'good' and ultimately nurturing way either. I never put the theory to the test however, since I ceased all communication as soon as I came to this conclusion. This however gives us a second problem .... how should we make others aware of what is, usually, only an opinion of someone's real stance? fc x
"I'm not quite sure what we're supposed to do
So I've been writing just for you" | ||
| 28 Oct 05, 12:59 PM MissHeart 8 yrs |
"whatever that bigotry may be."
Hi Chris Bigot defined in The concise Oxford Dictionary 1982 print as obstinate and intolerant adherant of a creed or view No reference to the view or creed. Because of who I am I have been on the receiving end of such peoples view. I have heared it stated that people like myself are all gay child molestors (This by a so called straight male, who likes to wear, stockings and high heels) People being people will always have within them to a greater or lesser degree the idea that "My fetish is harmless but yours is sick" and "I'm a normal person but you are a danger to those around you". In my run of the mill life I have witnessed first hand (and I mean first hand, seen and heared with my own eyes and ears) people who I have heared and seen treat their children in the most appalling way (locking them out crying on a balcony, shouting profanties at the top of their voices at them) join a mob and rampage through the area I lived in casuing damage and terror on the pretext they were protecting their children. Bigots are a fact of life but the worst ones are those who hide behind an excuse that they are doing the "right" thing. Mel' | ||
| 28 Oct 05, 1:12 PM Mel_SnM UK(BA), 7 yrs |
if I hit our sub during a play session or engage with her in a hurt you way I am in control.. and yes I enjoy it.. If I hit her because I'd lost my temper and it was a knee jerk reaction and I cracked her one across the face then its not on and I should be shot.. thats the difference for me... I would no more go out and hit a stranger in the street that I would hit her outside the agreed parameters of consent. its not about pain.. it's about the freedom to feel that vunerable with someone you trust | ||
| 28 Oct 05, 1:22 PM WaterDragon UK(LN), 6 yrs |
Bigotry of ANY kind must be condemned, weather that is physical or intellectual. I have no brief for the German National Socialism, and have serious reservations about the use of Nazi uniforms in any circumstances. Though I must say, that "Ello Ello" was great fun. Strong views of any kind can become bigotry, and perhaps even result in Political Correctness. Hugs, Irene. | ||
| 28 Oct 05, 1:42 PM Backdooruk UK(BA), 12 yrs |
Some certainly do, though of course there are other reasons for domestic violence.
This is the key question. I appreciate that some people like to build a fantasy world around their kink, and that they get more of a rush by (both sides) pretending that women are really more submissive, worthless or that they really are supreme etc. Others I suspect (as you suggest) are just caught up in their own propaganda. In the end you can only go on what they say. If someone says, “I'm only pretending because me and my partner get off on it” I'm obligated to give them the benefit of the doubt. What we can all identify clearly is when a sentiment is expressed outside of the recognised boundaries of a scene, a club or relationship. When someone says something objectionable then, they might still be joking but shouldn't be surprised if they are taken to task over it. And this is a good thing if we don't want to be accused of blurring the boundaries between consent and crime. - Chris Old member names: Backdoor, 1999-2002; Notvelvet, 2003-2004; Thought, 2004-2005. | ||
| 28 Oct 05, 1:47 PM goodghirl UK, 8 yrs |
Ive never ever heard a Dom/me saying they hate subs have you?
I dont know what subs you talk too online none I know seem pathetic/weak or worthless and the Dom/mes I know arent powerful/ wonderful/ divine theyre human like me with god and bad days
I didn't hear you complain when I was on my knee's | ||
| 28 Oct 05, 2:02 PM april1961 UK(WC), 8 yrs |
Blimey, it's just that kind of attitude that gives BDSM a bad name! And it's only the thin edge of the wedge. I understand that there are even private parties, attended by some really sick pups, at which screenings of "Sorry" are deemed to be perfectly acceptable.............
(I apologise Chris. It must be Friday......
People who sign themselves with some bit of "wise" twaddle, which usually reads like something one might find in a ghastly Xmas cracker, should be shot. Edited 28 Oct 05, 2:42 PM by april1961 | ||
| 28 Oct 05, 3:26 PM MKane 9 yrs |
Good point. Who decides who is a bigot and what should not be tolerated? What criteria is used? Who gets appointed Judge and Jury? This can verge on the "My Kink is OK but yours is not". If you decide to adhere to a certain creed, or 'party line', and to not tolerate XXX, doesn't one then become bigotted against XXX and become a bigot oneself? Where is the line drawn between understanding, tolerance, intolerance, prejudice, bigotry? And who's line is it anyway? Yours or mine? --------------------------------------------------- - Edited 28 Oct 05, 3:29 PM by MKane | ||
| 28 Oct 05, 4:16 PM Backdooruk UK(BA), 12 yrs |
My point is that we don't let "my kink is OK but yours is not" be an excuse for things that are not based on kink. This criteria is clear, even if it's not always apparent when something is a kink or just a prejudice. - Chris
Old member names: Backdoor, 1999-2002; Notvelvet, 2003-2004; Thought, 2004-2005. |
