What is vanilla? (67)

There is a wide range of activities that those inside and outside the community regard as normal and a lot of overlap between them, but if your priority is to be extreme in your own thoughts and actions then you are more likely to see those who are not as vanilla.

Personally I find the vanilla flavour anything but bland but I like a woman who feels the need to submit to the will of another - yet even within IC there are those who like only to play and those who regard the priority as giving themselve to the service of another (and likewise accepting that offering).

Vanilla is a word and IMO, like many other words, it does not have a fixed meaning - it has to be interpreted in a context.

This is indeed one of the problems with it. Vanilla does mean different things, not just within our community, but outside in the wider world. It is not a word which actually says anything. It is not a defining word, it is a weak, cover-all, messy word and when compared to non-kinky or nk it is shown up for what it is, a word which means only what each of it wants it to mean.

NK would say simply and accurately that an activity or person was not kinky. I cannot think what would be easier than that. It holds no value judgement and no room for misunderstanding. It is a simple opposite to us as kinky and what we do as kinky. It describes without confusion.

Dominant partner in an FLR with @paulss

Yes. It might be a tad arrogant. I do accept that point. Calling them 'Vanilla' is no less an arrogance though.

I choose to say 'unknowning' because it covers innocence in all forms, but you correctly point out that someone who does know, may choose not to indulge.

At the end of the day, it's still just shorthand for that which is not 'us' or what 'we' do.

It'll never catch on.

Within what is termed our society/community (other terms are available). We don't even agree on a strict definition of BDSM. Why should vanilla be any different.

When used in context, who can hold up their hand, and say 'I don't understand what you mean'?

Owner of The Croppery Dungeon and Breakfast. Organises The St Leonards munch.

It doesn't have to catch on. I didn't suggest it to win a popularity contest or to fit in with what I thought people would like.

I suggested it because it is neutral, descriptive and logical.

I am under no illusion about how rubbish we are in this bdsm world of ours a doing much which is sensible.

I tend to use non-kinky myself and probably will continue to do so. I am sure of what it means to me as the communicator of my message and to the readers or receivers of it. This cannot be said for 'vanilla' which may or may not mean similar things within the kinky atmosphere of IC but definitely doesn't mean the same to anyone outside of bdsm, unless you are referring to a sweet flavouring often used in ice cream.

Dominant partner in an FLR with @paulss

I agree with your first definition @Rhoobarb.

As far as I can see, the term 'vanilla' is often used by others as a form of put down for people they think can't possibly have as exciting-a-sex-life-as-meee.

Until this year everyone had a sex life more exciting than me whether they were kinky or vanilla, so that's wrong.

However; consider this - the term 'vanilla' is merely a definition which is culturally specific to us.

There are many cultures in the world where women are kept at home, confined, unable to do anything without their husband or father's (the man whose 'protection' they are under) consent, and even then only with a chaperone. They ae not allowed out on their own after dark, etc. They live their lives within very strict guidelines and unable to choose which rubber dress to wear without underwear.

To many of us in this community to be so confined would be kinky indeed (although admitted most would only consider it with consent, which is usually lacking in the above). However, to thousands and millions who live like that they do not consider themselves kinky but extremely vanilla living the norm, the convential traditional way in that society.

Which would make the norm, in that case 'vanilla' extremely kinky to others?

Admittedly I have left out the whole issue of consent, which is what makes it different, but I think you get my drift that the word and our meaning of "vanilla" is nevertheless culturally specific.

Edited 30 Jan 12, 1:33 PM by Black0rchid

:T:

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The Warehouse: pony play etc, Sat 7 Apr 2012, Exodus, Birmingham

Happiness is a warm bum

tanken wrote: I think some of us can be both 'vanilla' and kinky

Could you give some example of your view please, Tanken. I'm not wishing to be rude, but I think that a statement like that does need some explaining.

Given the OP.