Judicial Punishment 2 (56)

The problem is that you're creating options where options don't exist. I agree with you that almost anyone would take the caning as opposed to a draconian prison sentence if given that option. That doesn't make the caning just - simply expeditious.

I don't think that a willingness to consensually conduct such a caning makes you a bad person nor do I think it makes your kink a bad kink. You said in an earlier post that your sub saying an extreme session rated an 11 on the scale gave you a kick. That's responsible, engaged, healthy BDSM, so far as I'm concerned. I don't care how far you take it. If you both want her left bleeding and unconscious, that's okay. But we all know that's not what happened here.

Is it then "bad" to enjoy watching it? I don't know. I doubt that any of us know what's good or bad for someone else's psyche or soul, etc.

My point hasn't been about what's good or bad. I said in an earlier post that morality isn't what should filter our response, it's recognition of the difference between that video and BDSM. They're not the same thing.

I don't think it's sick to fantasize about enduring a similar caning. I've had those fantasies myself. I've also had some significantly harrowing rape fantasies. That still doesn't mean that I want to watch another woman being raped. If I did see such a thing, my thoughts would not be caught up in how hot it is and how much I'd like to be in her position. My thoughts would be about how frightened she must be, how much she hurts, how long this brief few minutes of self-indulgent rage on the part of her rapist is going to scar her for years to come.

You see, for me, there is a remarkable difference between fantasizing about myself in extreme pain, terror and helplessness and witnessing someone else in that same position - someone who doesn't fantasize about it. That non-consent is hot for you doesn't make it hot for the man in JP video. How would you feel if someone you love and honor was brutally beaten or raped and I was sitting in front of my screen watching the video of it over and over again to get off?

I don't think kink is sick. I believe that the human mind is capable of great imagination and endurance. But there are sick things in this world and I like to be pretty clear about the separation between those sick things and kink - yours or mine. In spite of the fun you had putting thoughts in my head and words in my mouth when you posted, I don't think my differing opinion makes me morally superior to you. I just think you're having a difficult time separating your hot fantasy from someone else's painful reality and that does make me uncomfortable. It makes me uncomfortable because it blurs the lines too much. The "real thing" makes for great fantasy and provides the groundwork for a smoking hot scene construct - but it's not consensual BDSM, it's something else altogether. As much as you're trying to bandy about my kink vs your kink my point all along has been that it's not the victim's kink and I just think that deserves some respect.

love the brave but avoid cowards, knowing the gratitude of cowards is small ~Praxilla of Sicyon

His rights have also been violated by having his name read out by the police chief in the video. No-one has picked up on that possible human rights violation yet.

Personally, I would rather not have seen the video, but it was there, so I did, out of curiosity. It happened, life goes on.

Rubber Roy

jstripes says that he wants this kind of thing in a non-consensual way.Well I kind of understand that,crazy as it looks at first glance.For it to work for some people there really needs to be that element of coercion in the mix.It can be hard work for the Dom/me and sometimes you really fear that there may be recriminations afterwards,although to be fair I have never found myself in that situation.

I just can't accept the non consensual argument on state sanctioned punishments though because they are all non consensual,even a speed camera fine or a parking ticket. I think what you are picking up on is the physical violation involved but in my case prison would be far,far worse.

To be perfectly frank about it if I found myself in the situation that this guy was in I would regard it as rather hot that people all around the world would watch it and get off on it for years afterwards.Analyse that.

Edited 10 Feb 10, 12:39 PM by BooteDom

That.

Also, while I can wholly support YKIOK, that only applies to kink. I'm all for people indulging their kink, but since consensuality is inherently part of the definition of kink, what's on that video clip just isn't kink at all.

So personally I didn't enjoy watching it, neither did I think of it as bdsm, nor titilating, nor consensual. I do however believe it was right to film it for others to see, surely it would be more wrong for such things to happen in secret. If some people found it erotically enjoyable, well we can't choose our kinks any more than we can choose our sexuality so I'm not going to criticise.

As some have raised the question, given the choice between taking such a punishment and getting it over with quickly or spending time in jail which could have more far-reaching consequences on your life (like losing your job, home, social life, liberty, ability to work, unpaid bills, mortgage etc) I'd choose the short sharp shock of a lesson learned and get it over with quickly with the caning too.

I think the whole "moral" argument is a minefield, they aren't "your" morals but values you've been taught and conditioned to believe are right by the society you live in. The criteria you judge things against are entirely dependent upon ideas ingrained into you by your particular society, education system and ultimately government of the land. These will vary from country to country and what is morally right is a very subjective concept. If Malaysian society believes this is the correct punishment for the crime we are free to disagree but although your views may conform to modern Western society, do think twice before you assert that your views are more correct or valid than their own.

I did watch a tv programme tonight featuring a serial thief / burglar who had been sent to prison 26 times, and couldn't help thinking that 23 of his victims may not have objected to the 3 strikes and we'll chop your hand off type of justice.

Edited 12 Feb 10, 2:16 AM by Trussedworthy