A Moral Question (92)

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So this is part of what I think. In this politically correct heavily legislated country we live in it should not matter, and were we talikng about working in a shop where it does not matter who you are served by (for example) then it definitely should not matter, its about how that person, whoever they are or whoever they were, does the job they are emploeyd to do.

But this lifestyle is not politically correct is it? not really even a little bit. Its about safe, sane consensual, its about freedom of choice outside of the usual societal contstraints, its about risk aware, consenual kink, so therefore should it not be that anyone, client or not, should know that they may be submitting to someone who did not begin life as a genetic female? thats if this is the situation they are in, ie Mistress and male sub, equally applies to Master/sub I guess.

I have not discussed this with many subs, but, those who it has come up in conversation would rather know and then make their choice. which would be not to submit. And thats as far as I can go to know what I think, except to say I think it should not be witheld information if someone asks the question.

That said, what an awful situation to find yourself in, to change gender on its own is such a difficult decision, takes years to do and then to reach the point when the law considers you to be a woman, well it must be awful to feel you have to explain yourself again, so maybe its better to be upfront about it, let the client or non client make their own choice from the outset.

Even now I am still not sure what I really think.

My dungeon - http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/p/DominateNorth...

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No, I think there is a difference. Male subs may well appreciate the individual qualities a transgendered PD might have such as being tall, having blonde hair, and so on but still feel ultimately the session was misold to them if they had not been told that the PD was in fact not a biological woman. As I said in my earlier post as Mistress Keene that men often want a biological woman, for reasons which go beyond what medical reassignment surgery can create and we have to respect that.

I think the subs do feel thee is an element of deception in not being informed about whether the Mistress is a biological or TS woman.

Men who like to be intimate with TG/TS women know that, actively seek those ladies out and are of course very happy with the experience.

Men who do not actively seek TG/TS women are probably actively NOT looking for that and would feel very upset,confused, conflicted and possibly deceived if the first they knew was upon turning up and seeing what was clearly as TS/TG woman.

A session with a PD can be a time for a sub to be able to be utterly open, honest, about themselves and their desires, they feel vulnerable and often quite embarrassed about their needs and desires.

I don't think a PD be she TS or biological woman should underestimate this or what the submission process means to the male subs.

I don't think immorality comes into it but it is certainly not acting in line with an ideal of total honesty, and respect to keep something hidden that may well be of importance to him.

Regardless of what guff is said about PDing, we do have to think about our subs and their needs and expectations, and should operate according the the normal SSC or RACK theories.

Someone who gone through the process of gender reassignment must accept that although her perceptions of herself are totally female, it is not always the case that others see this the same way. In a shop or in the street, it is no one else business, but when booking a PD session, I think it is patently obvious that informing a potential client just to make sure he knows what he is actually consenting to and with whom is only the responsible, respectful and honest thing to do.

No matter what the motives the TG/TS woman might have had, the male sub will, if they find out and are uncomfortable, conclude it was a deliberate deception. Why would anyone in business risk being perceived as dishonest?

24/7 subs and slaves can and do live similar lives, it is only the concept of 'ownership' which separates them.

I find this a really difficult subject. I agree with all the comments about a TG being a woman but (and I understand this is down to my own feelings) I would not want to session with one. Sessioning is a very intimate thing for me and, (because of my own psyche) it would not work with someone who was born a male. I find it hard to explain why I think like this - it's almost innate - but it's a strong emotion.

Although not the same I unwittingly sessioned with a TV a number of years ago. It was only about 15 minutes into the session that I realised (she did not advertise as such and was very convincing) and the whole episode put me off sessioning for quite a while. It was not what I wanted

So I agree with those who say a TG should, on the business side, be open about their history. But, having said that, I can also see the reasons why a TG would not wish to do so - nor see why they should so. It is to do with the sensibilities of the client

Edited 25 Jun 09, 1:18 PM by lisal

I think this comes down to the client's ontological position. In a session (including their anticipation and recollection of the session) do they care about external reality (i.e. towards the realist end of the spectrum) or only about their own perceptions and experiences (relativist end of the spectrum).

(This supposes that they believe a transgendered person is qualititively different in a significant way to a person whose gender-presentation matches their biological gender.)

I think Romola is taking a somewhat relativist stance. Not everyone does.

(Someone suggested I was confusing relationships with pro-Domme sessions. I'm not hugely experienced but I don't think of them as qualitatively different; rather a difference of scale; a paid session has short time scale with no strings, explicit contract etc; a relationship has higher commitment, potentially longer timescales, less clear contractual terms. But both are to varying extents intimate interpersonal interactions).

Ubi caritas et amor, Deus ibi est. http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/posts/226772/

The road, may be bumpy , but it still leads us to our destination. Love conquers all, and makes the heart come alive

Hi wonderer

There can also be an in between here. Some of us see just one PD and have been doing so for a considerable amount of time. This means that you can build up both a personal and D/s relationship which is much more the paid session with a short time table etc...

I am not in any way suggesting that this is the same relationship as a lifestyle one but it does seem to be quite a common misconception here that all sessions with PDs are of the wham bam thank you ma'am variety

Not getting at you at all - just making a general point..

May I ask: Of the PDs that have had breast enhancements, how many of you announce it? And if you do, at what point do you reveal this? (e.g On your website? When the appointment is made? When the client arrives?)

Edited to rephrase a bit.

judy

I must be only one in a million (© David Bowie)

Edited 25 Jun 09, 11:06 AM by JudyInDsGuise

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"If no sexual offence is being committed it seems very odd indeed that there should be an offence for having an image of something which was not an offence," Lord Wallace of Tankerness
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