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emotional masochism (82)

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17 Oct 08, 7:06 AM
wonderer
UK, 5 yrs

pinkylucy wrote:
wonderer wrote:

Perhaps we need a bigger language. Some people seem to use even the term "abuse" in a positive sense.

... the language is getting so muddled up it makes this difficult to talk about and gets consensual and wonderful stuff mixed up with abusive and non consensual stuff which we have to be so careful of when it comes to BDSM discussion.

...

That's what I was trying to disentangle in my posting. You did it better with your personal insight and greater clarity.

BTW doesn't the OP have a wonderful website. Once I'd checked out all the pics I even had a look at some of the words ;-) A surprising number of disasters of various sorts, though not all particularly disastrous.

Edited 17 Oct 08, 7:15 AM by wonderer

17 Oct 08, 9:06 AM
Degenerate*
UK(M), 5 yrs

stormywaters wrote:
Pinkylucy, I do love your clarity and insight on this, brilliant.

I think you could say the same thing that you have been saying by thinking of it as knowing yourself. I think if we are lucky we are free to get to know ourselves in childhood; the security and stability of childhood leaves us free to do so, which is basically the 'work' of childhood, what childhood development is. But if we feel threatened, anxious and insecure in our childhoods we are preoccupied with survival and so not free to discover our selves.

So then we reach adulthood in a bit of a muddle, not quite sure who we are and what we want and with a lot of negativity about ourselves. That makes us vulnerable to abuse by others. The heart of the problem is this catch 22 type business of caring about ourselves. I don't have any answers but I do think, as you say, everything must be on a bedrock of love, respect and caring otherwise it is just abuse and I think, however lost you do feel with yourself, there is always part of you that knows what is abuse and what isn't. Then you have to act on that, go with it, or you are just abusing yourself. And that is what takes the most courage. It is as though there is a voice saying 'no, of course you can't have real happiness, BDSM with a partner who really cares about you, you can only have the shit, false stuff, ie abuse'. To ignore that voice and dare to insist on only loving BDSM partners for yourself is to break from powerful negativity about yourself.

If you come from abuse in childhood, maybe perpetuated on into adulthood, it really is bloody tough to break that circle, much easier, less painful, to stay hidden from yourself, hidden from your own deep pain, by staying with what is familiar, ie abuse, rather than dare to look the monster of your childhood unhappiness and distress in the face, to face it down and dare it to stop you having happiness, ie loving BDSM.

Does this make sense? As I say, I do admire your clarity.

oh stormywaters, I think there's much truth in your message. I do think a lot of the people you are descibing above just don't have a clue that the slightly satisfied feeling they get in their own destructive relationships from the drama can be fulfilled in a constructive loving relationship without the 'real harm / risk' attached, indeed, actually tailored with their horrible pleasure in mind.

De

21st Oct - Come on the demo against the porn ban and for sexual freedoms: http://www.caan.org.uk/updates/Action21Oct.html .
Sign up to CAAN's statement - http://www.caan.org.uk
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