Altering the perception of BDSM (97)

This topic is now full - if you want to reply, please make a new post on the board itself.

This post is on the BDSM Activism web board.

7 Oct 07, 6:41 PM
The_Big_Bear
UK(DL), 20 mths

mtii2007 wrote:
By all means, work against laws but don't make up words that vilify people who could possibly be your allies.
What wise words!
-
Carpe diem, carpe nox noctis!

7 Oct 07, 6:46 PM
Jahc99
UK, 2 yrs

The_Big_Bear wrote:

mtii2007 wrote:
By all means, work against laws but don't make up words that vilify people who could possibly be your allies.
What wise words!

I agree, but I still think there is much merit in the OP, and subsequent comments.
why poison your liver when I could eat it for you?

7 Oct 07, 7:04 PM
IndelibleMarker
UK(N), 3 yrs

mtii2007 wrote:
But that's the point, I'm really not positive about this progressing. This is a movement that I don't agree with. Which is why I'm not "out". I don't want people I know to know what I think about when masturbating, let alone what I do with others. I think privacy is a GOOD thing.
So do I, the problem is that the powers that be don't think privacy is a good thing and if you get into a legal battle your private BDSM activities can be used against you.

mtii2007 wrote:
By all means, work against laws but don't make up words that vilify people who could possibly be your allies.

IndelibleMarker wrote:
As upstanding people, humans are programmed to fear being called anything-phobic. We fear being called racist, sexist, or homophobic, even though the more intelligent among us will admit that we harbour some of these feelings naturally. There are groups of people that fear these words more than any other. Celebrities and Politicians for example, whose careers are perched on maintaining public favour. If, as a scene we develop a word used to call celebrities and politicians "kinkphobics" (but something with a better ring to it, like hedophobic or fetiphobic), then they will be far more likely to respond in our favour upon hearing the use of the phrase "phobic", and begin to fight alongside us rather than against us to help change public perception.
Words like fetiphobia or homophobia don't actually vilify people, in an odd psychological way they encourage them to ally themselves to us.
I'm not proposing this as a morally upstanding debate tactic, I'm proposing it as a form of positive manipulation which will make politicians fight for us, rather than worry that they will be seen as "another debaucherous politician" and desperately try to ignore us and push us under the carpet.
Politicians clamber over each other to be percieved by society as understanding and supportive of minority groups, be them colour, nationality or sexual preferance.
There is not a politician around who will publically agree that they are a "fetiphobe" and they will almost all try and prove that in fact they aren't. Many of those will prove that they aren't by helping foster understanding and will be more open to listen to our pressure groups like Backlash.
Tuam matrem feci,
Patrick
IndelibleMarker

7 Oct 07, 7:12 PM
z12345
16 mths No, what will happen is politicians will say "I'm not -----aphobic BUT I don't think people can consent to (.....)" or "I have no problem with mainstream S&M BUT (.....) is abuse" Just like their whitepaper on violent porn did.
The last page was all "We're not talking about "good" S&M, we're talking about "bad" S&M" which whilst ridiculous is unstoppable by inventing a word and putting it on wiki.
In fact, the same approach is used here eg "I have no problem with kink BUT coprophilia/needle play/TPE/whatever is just sick, sad and wrong"
Inventing this term will backfire.
(And I'm not at risk legally. I'm submissive and therefore "the victim" I know that's a "I'm alright, Jack" sort of answer. The laws DO need changing somehow. The way through isn't lumping people together.)

7 Oct 07, 7:18 PM
Jahc99
UK, 2 yrs

mtii2007 wrote:
The laws DO need changing somehow. The way through isn't lumping people together.
But isn't the purpose to single them out, make them account for their own attitudes?
(edited coz I am typing like a trout!)
why poison your liver when I could eat it for you?
Edited 7 Oct 07, 7:20 PM by Jahc99

7 Oct 07, 7:20 PM
ClassAct2005
UK, 3 yrs
Yes, good plan. I don't like the word kink because it suggests I'm abnormal and the kinky sex bit for me is peripheral to the overall feeling of submission, the power exchange part.
Interesting that a lot of things that people do think are abhorrent I don't however. I wonder what causes or caused that liberalism? I never thought bestiality should be illegal for example not that I can see the sexual appeal of it. Incest - no objections to that either (although the many first cousin marriages we have in the UK in certain communities have led to birth defects so we do need to control that side of it) and we're not even really allowed to write about children having sexual feelings in the UK so I won't even go there..... So what causes the view? Is it the way we're brought up or what we read? My parents were very liberal. My father's a psychiatrist. May be that is the cause of what I often see as very different view from the norm.

7 Oct 07, 7:26 PM
z12345
16 mths But that's not what's being suggested. The suggestion that people who are wary of, dislike, fear, don't know much about, work against, think it's stupid... about kink should be called something-a-phobic. Just like people who are wary of, dislike, fear, don't know much about, work against, think it's stupid about homosexuality are called homophobic.
It's not the same.
I mean, taking JUST sexual practices, the problem homophobes have with gays is the fact that a man puts a penis in another man. Get rid of that attitude and TADA! everyone can move on. Kinky people have soooooo many sexual practices, it'd be impossible to fight in the same way. Kinky people themselves can be xxxxaphobic about certain kinks.
Y'all are lumping kink-neg and kink-neutral people together.
The way forward involves films and books and stories and non-titilating documentaries. It doesn't involve entries on wiki telling people off for not being as liberal as you or I.

7 Oct 07, 8:05 PM
MasterOfMe
UK(WD), 3 yrs

ClassAct2005 wrote:
Yes, good plan. I don't like the word kink because it suggests I'm abnormal and the kinky sex bit for me is peripheral to the overall feeling of submission, the power exchange part.
Interesting that a lot of things that people do think are abhorrent I don't however. I wonder what causes or caused that liberalism? I never thought bestiality should be illegal for example not that I can see the sexual appeal of it. Incest - no objections to that either (although the many first cousin marriages we have in the UK in certain communities have led to birth defects so we do need to control that side of it) and we're not even really allowed to write about children having sexual feelings in the UK so I won't even go there..... So what causes the view? Is it the way we're brought up or what we read? My parents were very liberal. My father's a psychiatrist. May be that is the cause of what I often see as very different view from the norm.
I'm glad I'm not the only one
Edit to add: Although I don't have any problem with the word 'kinky'. For me it's just a description, the same as 'gay' and 'straight' are. Labels can be useful for clear communication, although you need to be careful of the difference between allowing labels to describe you and to define you.

Edited 7 Oct 07, 8:07 PM by MasterOfMe

7 Oct 07, 8:10 PM
MasterOfMe
UK(WD), 3 yrs
mtii raises some good points, and I agree it is something to be careful of. Something low-key is definitely called for here - my personal feelings are still teetering towards supporting the original proposal but I'm open to changing my mind
On a related note I know what is meant about kink being seen as 'silly', but that doesn't have to be a bad thing. After all 'silly' is also 'harmless'. Having said that a good case has been made and Fetiphobia could be the way to go.

7 Oct 07, 8:15 PM
z12345
16 mths See, I have no problem with the words "kinky" "deviant" "perverted" but I have huge problems with "Dom" "sub" "slave" "slut" when used in place of "girlfriend" or "boyfriend" I expect everyone's mileage differs on the words they like and don't like.
You have to be VERY careful that I'm not labelled as bdsmphobic because I get cross when someone calls their ex "my previous Dom" or someone else is because they prefer the word "kinky" over "kink".
I think the church is too broad to have any one single -aphobia.

Next page


	©1997-2009 Informed Consent