(deleted) (97)

I like the paraphiliaphobia, but, yeah, it's too long. And philiaphobia has been taken.

I just wonder if there's some sort of Ancient Greek root term for BDSM. Perhaps power+sex = dunagenophobia? Or pain+sex = algogenophobia? Or perhaps that sexuality comment was better => phuletikoteta => phuletikiphobia? (But that doesn't highlight the different aspect of the phobia; it could just be sexuality in general)

And, as a side note, yes, sadomasochism and fetishes are sexualities. I have read in more than one reference book (can't find the references now... ask me later) that listed sadomasochism, transvestitism, fetishes, peadophilia and others as "minority sexualities". So, yes, we are a sexuality, just a minor one. (Though again, there's that whole paedophilia thing again....)

Source for phobias: http://phobialist.com/

The problem seems to be that the memorably words (papaphobia etc) don't *actually* mean what we want them to and have negative connotations, whereas the ones that have a perfect meaning tend to be really long and difficult to remember (eg: algogenophobia).

~ = ~ = ~ = * c * = ~ = ~ = ~
"Oh bother," said the borg. "We've assimilated Pooh..."
Um, i'm fresh out of advice... can i interest you in a sarcastic comment??

Zen S&M; the sound of one hand smacking.

"you dont ride a boat, you row a boat" "oh boat, i thought you said goat?"

Before you keep reading, think to yourself briefly what you consider the dictionary definition of “homophobia” to be.

Those who did stop to think about it will have said along the lines of the fear or hatred of homosexuals and homosexuality, as definied in 1969 by the Oxford English Dictionary.

However, that's not the original definition of homophobia.

In 1920 the word homophobia was first founded. It means the fear of men, or aversion towards the male sex.

I would highly doubt that anyone knew that, I didn't until I started researching this topic in detail. It's certainly not common knowledge.

My point here of course is that the true definition of a word isn't actually always important. Language is what the people who use it make of it. The English language is forever developing and new words are being entered into the dictionary all the time.

The phrase homophobia has been warped to fight a battle and it has worked. The phrase feminism has been warped to indicate women who hate men when in fact it is the ideology of sexual equality. Why has it been warped? Because the word feminism has “fem” as it's building block. It gives the impression, just in how it is phrased that it is about female supremacy. Feminists have a negative image in general society and part of that is to do with poor wording for their ideology. If they used equalitarian, which is what they are fighting for, they would find their job a whole lot easier.

It's not important that equalitarian applies to all mankind and not just the two sexes. What is important is how society views them.

It's not important what paraphobia, helicophobia or philophobia actually means. What is important is what society thinks they mean.

It's not important that kinkphobia, fetiphobia or fetaphobia are “taken”. What is important is what we can manipulate society to think they mean.

Homophobia was taken in 1920, it was taken again in 1969. The modern definition of homophobia is in the Oxford English Dictionary. It is on Wikipedia. It is in the Microsoft Word spell-check. It has 5.3 million Google hits and is defined by Google in 11 separate places.

Fetiphobia has been “taken” to mean “fear of pro-life philosophy” (Skyfox blog 6 October)& Typhoon2). It is not in the Oxford English Dictionary. It is not listed in Wikipedia. It is not in the Microsoft Word spell-check. It has 3 Google hits and is not found with Google “define: fetiphobia”.

How can I possibly use those to prove my argument!? Because 99.99% of people use the Oxford English Dictionary, Wikipedia, Word and Google. No matter how much you dislike the fact, it is these sources which define a word within modern society. Nobody uses fetiphobia or even knows what it means.

I should also point out that although the word fetish has been warped itself. Although it specifically means “An object, a non-sexual part of the body, or a particular action which abnormally serves as the stimulus to, or the end in itself of, sexual desire.” To general society BDSM is a fetish. Like it or not, in our ongoing battles it's general society and politicians we need the support of.

It was commented that

If you recall from my opening post the psychological response to being acused of any reasonable word ending in phobia is to disrepute the claim. "Kinkaphobia" would generally result in a feeling of "They're making up words, I don't have a problem with a little kink, I'll tell them they're wrong" whereas "Fetiphobia" would typically create the thought process of "I've never heard that word before, they must be educated, I suppose I do have a bit of a phobia because I don't understand it, I better not let on, I'll try and support them to prove I don't". This is what happened to the homosexual community with the word homophobia.

So let's look at the positive benefits of “Fetiphobia”.

• It is instantly recognisable as being BDSM and Fetish related.
• It sounds like a mature and established word.
• It is short, easy to say and remember.
• No questions need to be asked regarding it's meaning.
• It is not a widely established word so the meaning can be adapted to suit our cause.

With a little planning and circulation of the word it could be quickly assimilated into Wikipedia with our specific definition. This would then mean it would appear on Google and could apply for entry into the Oxford English Dictionary.

(Please note, having two points; i) and ii), gives the word a more established and credible appearance.)

Tuam matrem feci,
Patrick
IndelibleMarker

"Frubbly" might be an example of a word that was made up (as a joke alternative to compersion, I believe) that got sneaked into a Guardian article ( http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,14518... ) giving it a lot more credibility (and polyamory itself is an example of a word recently made up, but now in dictionaries I believe).

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/extreme-images/

emark wrote: I agree with much of your post, but note that you won't get away with using Wikipedia to promote a term until it is used fairly widely (e.g., has been mentioned in a mainstream publication), and certainly when it doesn't have Google hits "Frubbly" might be an example of a word that was made up (as a joke alternative to compersion, I believe) that got sneaked into a Guardian article ( http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,14518... ) giving it a lot more credibility (and polyamory itself is an example of a word recently made up, but now in dictionaries I believe).

The scene is extremely diverse. I have, as well as know other people who have contacts who would be very interested in writing an article or talking publically about "Fetiphobia". Backlash and other organisations could greatly accelerate the process. As I said, with a little planning and circulation it could easily be accepted by Wikipedia as long as it has a well written definition, description and history.

Tuam matrem feci,
Patrick
IndelibleMarker

Edited 7 Oct 07, 5:24 AM by IndelibleMarker

I remember in the late eighties, early nineties A LOT of outing of gay men and women by activists to show how mainstream homosexuality was. I can only assume that is the shape all movements of these kinds.

I appreciate the fact that my vanilla friends have heard of S&M and find it amusing and titilating but don't know any more. It is convenient for me because they'd never work out what I like if S&M is all they've heard of.

Luckily for me I've never had to fight a custody battle and I can understand where a little compassion and understanding about bdsm could help mothers and fathers villified for their sexual practices. I don't download or make porn so I can't be "done" for the stupid new laws but I have done my bit to try to stop them. (as good as that it is!)

Apart from that sort of legal arena, I can't think of people that are bdsmphobic. They just think it is silly, don't they? The public just think it's funny and silly. Badly run publicity campaigns have a habit of turning the public against the group... and judging by how well people get on at munches (whispering campaigns), on these boards, arranging fairs etc, the campaign WOULD be badly run. (heh, no offence :P)

Can we leave vanillas to it?

Some of the public see it as "just funny and silly", others see it as dangerous and downright evil because they can't differenciate between abuse and BDSM activities. If you've never been subjected to that then you are very lucky and I would guess not as "out" about your sexual choices as myself or many other are. Even my parents threw their hands in the air and said I was "evil" before they took the time to learn about what it is I actually do.

People who have never met us judge us based purely on stereotypical perception. Dominant men are considered abusive, Dominant females are considered sexy and a positive thing, submissive females are seen as weak and submissive males are seen as gimps and basically a joke.

I can think of many BDSMphobic people, but again a factor which has been overlooked here is the way in which these words can be used to fight our cause. Homophobia is not used to describe people who fear homosexuals, it is often used to describe anyone who has any kind of dislike or misunderstanding of homosexuality.

"BDSMphobia" doesn't have to just be used to describe people who fear BDSM, it can also be used against those people in power who don't actively support alternative lifestyles, such as the politicians pushing through the current laws. But a "Fetiphobia" word isn't just to help fight the new laws, it's to help anybody who ever has to fight a BDSM related case at any point in the future.

Throwing your hands up and saying "we won't be able to organise it very well" isn't really a positive way to progress.

Tuam matrem feci,
Patrick
IndelibleMarker

I disagree with people actively discriminating against "people of kink". I do not think that the way through that is branding all people who think that kink is a) silly b) funny c) stupid d) dangerous e) abusive f) weak g) mental h) evil or i) ignorant of what it is as "bdsmphobic" or whatever you decide to call it and putting it on wiki.

You risk alienating people who are basically s&m (as they understand it) positive. You risk making people like my dad (for instance) saying "I have no problem with them but I wish they wouldn't shove it down my throat all the time"

Think about the main theme of all the messages on the boards. Someone suggests a kink. Someone says "yay!" someone says "boo!" someone says "meh" and someone says "that's not safe" If all the "that's not safe"rs and "boo!"ers and "meh"ers were called bdsmphobic, there'd be an uproar. In fact, as homework I'd like for you to try it! Everytime someone shows ignorance or lack of enthusiasm or hatred of a kink, call them kinkaphobic. It'll show you what I mean about vanilla people

The kinks encompassed are far far too broad. Vanilla people might accept certain aspects but it's unfair to expect them to accept them all when "we" can't even.

Hence, the path to being accepted and not discriminated against is DIFFERENT from the path LGBTQ people had to take.

And although it is negative, I think it's an entirely valid and important point that the "community" or "scene" have a poor track record in terms of harmony. "Scene people" and "non scene people" are different and yet they will get lumped together.

All it will take is a highly visible campaign to splinter and BAM the floating voters (who were neither kink pos or kink neg) to stereotype ALL of us as attention seeking, annoying, stupid, selfish, having poor social skills.

By all means, work against laws but don't make up words that vilify people who could possibly be your allies.