Altering the perception of BDSM (97)

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5 Oct 07, 9:12 PM
Ludovic
UK, 2 yrs
As apposed to creating a phobia, ism or ist based on fear of BDSM.... how about we target whats actually being attacked, namely pornography.
Pornophobic - and concentrate on mocking certain peoples immature fear of adult material?
"Stop being such a Pornophobe!, it's only a picture of 2 people having their idea of fun"
"Stop being such a Pornophobe!, your such a straight”
Gives people an opportunity to show support without actually supporting BDSM
After all just because it's extreme in their eye's doesn't make it any less pornographic
Edited 5 Oct 07, 9:13 PM by Ludovic

5 Oct 07, 9:24 PM
Crystal_Eyes
UK(SA), 2 yrs
That deals with the immediate problems we're facing in light of the latest government plans on 'violent pornography', but in the longer term there's still a lot of BDSM practices misunderstood. We need a term broad enough to incorporate *all* branches of fetishism, but not *too* broad so as to lose sight of what we're actually about.
Also, porn is viewed by a lot of people *not* into BDSM, and has a lot of people anti it anyway. Hence, it runs the risk of its meaning being altered to mean *all* porn and not just the current fetish porn being scrutinised by the government.
Lastly (sorry - this wasn't meant to be the essay it's turned into, but i just thought of another point!), there are those within the BDSM community who insist that it's not just about sex. Porn is sex, and therefore inextricably links BDSM with sex, which is not something that some people agree with.
~ = ~ = ~ = * c * = ~ = ~ = ~
"Oh bother," said the borg. "We've assimilated Pooh..."
Um, i'm fresh out of advice... can i interest you in a sarcastic comment??

5 Oct 07, 9:32 PM
Ludovic
UK, 2 yrs
I see where your coming from, perhaps pornophobia or any other phobia isn't the correct starting point.
Thing is... we need BDSM to be classified firstly as a sexuality as apposed to a fetish or perversion or a mental illness (I think it's still classified as such in certain medical journals and textbooks)
Homosexuality has a tick box for sexuality on census forms, we need more people to add a box that says BDSM next time they fill in a census and just like "Jedi” nearly managed to be considered a religion, it might be recognized officially… as a sexuality.
Edited 5 Oct 07, 9:34 PM by Ludovic

5 Oct 07, 9:53 PM
Crystal_Eyes
UK(SA), 2 yrs
But, is it a sexuality? I agree with having it disregarded as a mental disorder (i only found out today that it *was*!) as it's a very out-dated perception, but i don't think we can go so far as to call it a sexuality. I mean, it's an *aspect* of sexuality, certainly. But you can't be homosexual and heterosexual, whereas you can be homosexual and into BDSM.
However, getting it accepted (or at least, not openly and actively shunned as a sickness) is a vital first step.
~ = ~ = ~ = * c * = ~ = ~ = ~
"Oh bother," said the borg. "We've assimilated Pooh..."
Um, i'm fresh out of advice... can i interest you in a sarcastic comment??

5 Oct 07, 10:22 PM
Ludovic
UK, 2 yrs
Is it a sexuality?
Could you feel fulfilled and satisfied in a long term relationship without some aspect of BDSM? I know I couldn't…
Homosexuality bears no children other then love and sexual fulfilment, I think the same could be said for BDSM.
Besides it's not about what we think, its what the general public thinks. If we publicly state it is at every opportunity then eventually it will become more widely accepted as such!
If we can get BDSM recognised as a sexuality, then we will automatically receive the same level of protection for employment etc that homosexuals now receive, and can legally claim we're being discriminated against.

6 Oct 07, 4:29 AM
emark
UK, 5 yrs I agree with what is said in the OP. Whilst it may be technically a poor debate tactic to accuse someone of being homophobic, the use of language to portray things as bad is an important tactic.
"BDSM" has partly done this - although it still has some stigma, it is at least a term associated solely with consensual relationships, whereas sadism or sadomasochism has connotations of non-consensual acts, and mental illness.
This is an issue with the extreme porn law, in that supporters are using this tactic against us. Phrases like "extreme porn" and "violent porn" are highly misleading for various reasons, and obviously make most people turn against it, making it harder to defend. "Porn" itself has negative connotations - the obvious alternative would be erotica. I'm not sure if there are any good alternative names for "extreme porn". (BDSM erotica? Of course the problem is that supporters would say the law won't criminalise all BDSM material - but then, it won't criminalise all violent porn either, not to mention that "extreme" is an entirely subjective term, so that's no different.)

Crystal_Eyes wrote:
But, is it a sexuality? I agree with having it disregarded as a mental disorder (i only found out today that it *was*!) as it's a very out-dated perception, but i don't think we can go so far as to call it a sexuality. I mean, it's an *aspect* of sexuality, certainly. But you can't be homosexual and heterosexual, whereas you can be homosexual and into BDSM.
I agree it's an aspect of sexuality - being dominant or submissive, submissive or masochistic, having a fetish or whatever are all parts of sexuality.
I don't see how "a sexuality" is any different - to me, that's just a shorthand way of saying it's an aspect of sexuality. I don't see why being "a sexuality" means it has to be mutually exclusive with homo- or heterosexuality.
Possibly you are confusing it with sexual orientation? It isn't really a sexual orientation, though that's simply a matter of definition, as sexual orientation is usually defined in terms of which gender one is attracted to (though one could argue it counts as sexual orientation under a more broader definition of "what one is attracted to", and certainly it may share similar properties, in that for some people their primary factor in seeking sexual partners may be, e.g., that they are dominant, rather than being a particular gender).
Also, AFAIK a problem seems to be that laws covering things like discrimination against sexuality seem to specifically refer to sexual orientation rather than general sexuality?
http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/extreme-images/

6 Oct 07, 10:48 AM
Typhoon2
UK, 4 yrs
Y! Curses! Fetiphobia has already been bagged at http://bellsouthpwp.net/m/a/maryb683/marybrown/g.... The relevant description is:
FETIPHOBIA: The irrational fear that the acknowlegement of the fundamental right to life for prenatal children must somehow diminish the nature or standing of women in society.

6 Oct 07, 11:02 AM
Proccie
UK(HP), 2 yrs

We however must not be 'nillaphobic, which leads of course to the word "nillarist".
I quite like "erotophobia" as a word, it challenges the "Mary Whitehouse" tendency to demonise anything which is not between the sheets and in the dark.
proccie
Expectations are premeditated resentments. So you can all just fuck off OK?
Edited 6 Oct 07, 11:30 AM by Proccie

6 Oct 07, 12:25 PM
MasterOfMe
UK(WD), 3 yrs

Fetiphobia sounds wrong, I'm no sure why but it does. It is possibly the best suggestion so far though.
As previously mentioned paraphobia will not make the 'link' in peoples heads (I thought paralysed/wheelchair/disabled rather than parachutes/paratroopers).
The OP is absolutely right though, words have power and using them correctly can make a huge difference to public perception.
This comes down to more than needing a single word though, we need to reclaim some words, redefine others and possibly create new ones.
'kinky' is no longer generally seen as bad - that is a start - but many other words are still a problem. 'Pervert' is an example, we need to either reclaim pervert or stop using it for ourselves.
How about 'fetish', how is that word perceived? I don't think it is overwhelmingly negative, but it still has connotations of a sad lonely old man wanking over a pile of womens underwear.
So lets go with Kinky, after all lots of people enjoy the odd spanking, use a pair of handcuffs, dress up in stockings and suspenders, etc. People can identify with 'a bit of kink to spice up their sex life'.
So how about Kinkaphobic and Kinkism? They both work and have quite a 'harsh' sound which can be good for giving a word negative connotations. They don't exactly roll off the tongue though so you could perhaps soften it up a bit and you have Kinaphobic and Kinism - both of which are much easier to say.
It would also be worth widening the definition slightly:
Kinaphobic: Noun
i) the fear of consensual sexual activities which deviate from the norm or people who engage in those practices.
ii) unreasoning fear of or antipathy towards consensual BDSM related activities or people who engage in those activities.
We could also do with a good positive names for people who do engage in such activities and people who don't. Homosexual and Heterosexual style names that are clear and unambiguous.
Kinkasexual and Vanillasexual are obviously not going to work for all sorts of reasons but remember we want these words to give the positive connotation to the kinksters while not excluding or insulting the vanillas.
Terms like 'adventurous', 'experimental', 'explorational' all have positive connotations so perhaps something along those lines could be used?
Connecting it to the Kinaphobic term would be good so the two will be associated in peoples' minds.
One idea which I have mixed feelings on would be extending the term straight to be vanilla as well as heterosexual - but there are still enough negative connotations to 'gay' that people might not want to lose their 'straight' label. Perhaps a similar term though...Square? Already taken but it does have the sort of negative 'straight laced' connotations we want...
So can anyone come up with a pair of words, one for the kinksters and one for the straight squares?
I seem to have run out of ideas since my mind is stuck on 'kinksters' and 'oblongs' which I think sounds a bit silly!

6 Oct 07, 1:07 PM
BrianC
UK(TQ), 3 yrs

BDSM is not a fetish, but BDSM and fetishism can go together and often do, especially in clubs. We are looking for a word that will normalise BDSM rather than a word that defines a condition. So I guess it just has to have the right ring to it.
A phobia is a type of anxiety disorder, not just an irrational dislike of something. Homophobia isn't a phobia. It's used to label an unwelcome dislike of homosexuality.
If we accept current common usage of the term homophobia, then the logical term for us to use would be paraphiliphobia, because paraphilia is the umbrella term for the whole range of kinks. Trouble is, it's too long. And not many people know the word paraphilia. But I can't cope with paraphobia and really don't like fetiphobia. I could live with the sound of fetishphobia but it is just too inaccurate by half.
So I'm definitely not sure.

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