Altering the perception of BDSM (97)

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5 Oct 07, 6:52 PM
purplepenny
UK(WC), 5 yrs
There's an American book called Underneath the Skins by Ivo Dominguez that tried to address just this linguistic question a decade ago. But he came up with 'leatherphobia", which is more likely to make people think about vegetarian arguments in the current cultural context.
Fetphobia sounds like the best of the available options to me. IMO words are vital. Not having a name can help you to slip under the radar... but at present we (meaning 'the community', though of course it's hard to define who that is) have been stuck on the radar screen whether we like it or not by the government demonisation of 'violent pornography', I wish we did have some established terminology of our own to fight back with.

5 Oct 07, 7:10 PM
IndelibleMarker
UK(N), 4 yrs

purplepenny wrote:
There's an American book called Underneath the Skins by Ivo Dominguez that tried to address just this linguistic question a decade ago. But he came up with 'leatherphobia", which is more likely to make people think about vegetarian arguments in the current cultural context.
Fetphobia sounds like the best of the available options to me. IMO words are vital. Not having a name can help you to slip under the radar... but at present we (meaning 'the community', though of course it's hard to define who that is) have been stuck on the radar screen whether we like it or not by the government demonisation of 'violent pornography', I wish we did have some established terminology of our own to fight back with.
If anyone is interested in this book it's actually called Beneath the Skins.
Theres something about Fetphobia which doesn't quite sound right to me, when said out loud it sounds more like 2 separate words than it should do. For me, calling someone a Fetiphobic just has a slightly better psychological and "knowledgable" ring to it. Things like leatherphobia or smphobia or fetphobia don't have the same punch because they the word sounds so "divided" and unprofessional. I still prefer Fetaphobic or Fetiphobic, pronounced Fet "ih" phobic with a short i sound the same as the word fetish. Not fet-eye-phobic or fet-ee-phobic.
Tuam matrem feci,
Patrick
IndelibleMarker

5 Oct 07, 7:11 PM
The_Big_Bear
UK(DL), 2 yrs
Y!
I agree with most here - the OP has a very good point, and argues it excellently.
However, let's not rush into making up new words - particularly when there are some perfectly good words in the language already.
I do agree with the OP that the use of a -phobia word could be very effective. Calling the objectors to BDSM phobic is in effect saying to them 'no, we're not in the wrong, it's you that's being scared'. I agree - nobody likes to be told they're "just being ___phobic"
I've therefore been looking up some useful phobia terms. Here's what I found;
Paraphobia - the fear of sexual perversion (that's almost exactly what we want, isn't it?)
Agraphobia or Centraltophobia - both meaning the the fear of sexual abuse might be useful, but neither of them is an easy or memorable word, and the meaning doesn't quite set the right tone.
But my own favourite is; EROTOPHOBIA — fear of sexual love or sexual questions. It's not as good a definition-fit as Paraphobia, and I know some community members will not be comfortable with the equating of BDSM with sex. Personally though I like it because it will be immediately understood and because it directly counter-attacks the critic by mocking their own sexuality, ie "you're only calling us perverts because of your own sexual inadequacy!".
Down with the Erotophobes!!!
-

Carpe diem, carpe nox noctis!

5 Oct 07, 7:29 PM
IndelibleMarker
UK(N), 4 yrs

The_Big_Bear wrote:
I agree with most here - the OP has a very good point, and argues it excellently.
However, let's not rush into making up new words - particularly when there are some perfectly good words in the language already.
I do agree with the OP that the use of a -phobia word could be very effective. Calling the objectors to BDSM phobic is in effect saying to them 'no, we're not in the wrong, it's you that's being scared'. I agree - nobody likes to be told they're "just being ___phobic"
I've therefore been looking up some useful phobia terms. Here's what I found;
Paraphobia - the fear of sexual perversion (that's almost exactly what we want, isn't it?)
Agraphobia or Centraltophobia - both meaning the the fear of sexual abuse might be useful, but neither of them is an easy or memorable word, and the meaning doesn't quite set the right tone.
But my own favourite is; EROTOPHOBIA — fear of sexual love or sexual questions. It's not as good a definition-fit as Paraphobia, and I know some community members will not be comfortable with the equating of BDSM with sex. Personally though I like it because it will be immediately understood and because it directly counter-attacks the critic by mocking their own sexuality, ie "you're only calling us perverts because of your own sexual inadequacy!".
Down with the Erotophobes!!!
-

Really interesting that,
Paraphobia is probably the best fit but I'm not sure it's quite the perception we want to give out. Sexual perversion covers a specrum which is too broad and will link us in with paedophiles etc
Anything which mentions abuse is a big no no. The general public have a hard enough time defining between abuse and BDSM as it is.
Erotophobia again is a little too broad, but is also my favourite of the three, the problem isn't that people percieve sex as a problem, it's that they percieve BDSM, or what they call "S&M" a problem as it "encourages abuse", "anti feminism", "encourages violence" etc etc. I think it would be percieved as trying to gold plate a dog turd: "Erotophobia is a fear of sex. I'm not afraid of sex, I'm afraid of your extreme and violent S&M natures"

Tuam matrem feci,
Patrick
IndelibleMarker

5 Oct 07, 7:35 PM
doulos
UK, 4 yrs
I am not sure I like the way "phobia" is often used in political debate. I think both "homophobia" and "Islamophobia" for example have been misused.
Having said that, if every other interest group is using them... paraphobia would be the best, as it more or less translates as fear of difference. Sex means too many different things for people to be "afraid" of it, and fetishes are too diverse for someone to hate ALL of them on principle. What we're really talking about is sexuality that isn't yours. And thats the attitude we are wanting to challenge: the one that says only your particular view is sexuality (or the mainstream one) is acceptable.
"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard." H. L. Mencken
Edited 5 Oct 07, 7:36 PM by doulos

5 Oct 07, 7:41 PM
Master_of_lb
UK, 2 yrs

The_Big_Bear wrote:
I agree with most here - the OP has a very good point, and argues it excellently.
Me too - "Fetiphobia" wins it for Me.

The_Big_Bear wrote:
However, let's not rush into making up new words -
dot dot dot
But my own favourite is; EROTOPHOBIA — fear of sexual love or sexual questions.
Not sold on that one - I'd prefer paraphobia, for the simple reason that the uneducated masses (Myself included) would assume that erotophobia meant "fear of eroticism"... which means that a lot of our target audience would immediately say "No I'm not, I like sex as much as anyone, it's the blood and pain I object to". They would *think* they knew what it meant and would be wrong.
... but again, in the case of paraphobia, they would *know* that they didn't know what it meant (fear of parachuting?), so explanations would be needed.
... whereas fetphobia/fetiphobic says what it is, and any fule should be able to figure it out fairly quickly.
I like it!
Moflb
If you're asking that question, you'll never understand the answer.
You know, most people watch telly on Sunday afternoons...

5 Oct 07, 7:48 PM
IndelibleMarker
UK(N), 4 yrs

doulos wrote:
I am not sure I like the way "phobia" is often used in political debate. I think both "homophobia" and "Islamophobia" for example have been misused.
Having said that, if every other interest group is using them... paraphobia would be the best, as it more or less translates as fear of difference. Sex means too many different things for people to be "afraid" of it, and fetishes are too diverse for someone to hate ALL of them on principle. What we're really talking about is sexuality that isn't yours. And thats the attitude we are wanting to challenge: the one that says only your particular view is sexuality (or the mainstream one) is acceptable.
I agree they are wrongly used a lot of the time, but people are easy to predict and manipulate, if we can use that knowledge to initiate positive change of perception in the same way "homophobia" did, then we should do it in my opinion.
I'm concerned that being 'Paraphobic' would be deemed acceptable because social perception of "perverts" often involves children these days. Also I don't feel it's instantly recognisable as BDSM related to be encouraged to be widely used. The meaning would forever have to be explained to people which means it will fail at the first hurdle. I think we need to be very specific to BDSM and BDSM only.

Tuam matrem feci,
Patrick
IndelibleMarker
Edited 7 Oct 07, 3:42 AM by IndelibleMarker

5 Oct 07, 7:49 PM
IndelibleMarker
UK(N), 4 yrs

Master_of_lb wrote:

The_Big_Bear wrote:
I agree with most here - the OP has a very good point, and argues it excellently.
Me too - "Fetiphobia" wins it for Me.

The_Big_Bear wrote:
However, let's not rush into making up new words -
dot dot dot
But my own favourite is; EROTOPHOBIA — fear of sexual love or sexual questions.
Not sold on that one - I'd prefer paraphobia, for the simple reason that the uneducated masses (Myself included) would assume that erotophobia meant "fear of eroticism"... which means that a lot of our target audience would immediately say "No I'm not, I like sex as much as anyone, it's the blood and pain I object to". They would *think* they knew what it meant and would be wrong.
... but again, in the case of paraphobia, they would *know* that they didn't know what it meant (fear of parachuting?), so explanations would be needed.
... whereas fetphobia/fetiphobic says what it is, and any fule should be able to figure it out fairly quickly.
I like it!
Moflb
This really sums up my points excellently. Thanks
Tuam matrem feci,
Patrick
IndelibleMarker
Edited 5 Oct 07, 7:55 PM by IndelibleMarker

5 Oct 07, 8:19 PM
Jahc99
UK, 3 yrs
Paraphobia sounds like a fear of jumping out of airplanes, or maybe big blokes in combats with guns. I like fetphobia, myself, well, the word, that is, not encountering it.
why poison your liver when I could eat it for you?

5 Oct 07, 8:23 PM
ikklesubbie
UK(G), 3 yrs
I think that it is an important area that shopuld be consulted widely because it has to be a united front.
As someone above says, there is already just about a phobia for everything, I wouldn't be surprised if there was one relating to bdsm (I will look in my masses of psych books and knowledge).
I think as a term fetiphobia, or fetphobia (though the latter sounding wrong, and forced in my mind) are good terms to start with but much consultation would have to be done through munches and other forums, because the only way this would ever work is if we as a "community" stand together, and people must want to stand for that to work.
I will be in trigued to see how this progresses.
"If you think you're too small to make a difference, you've obviously never been in bed with a mosquito" - Michelle Walker

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