Is it time to raise the bar? (96)

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11 Jun 08, 2:25 PM
x_Red_x
UK(KT), 3 yrs

Admin wrote:

x_Red_x wrote:
On a further note, I mentioned this post, which is so blatantly "if you go to see Pro-Dommes you're stupid", and yet it still stands there. Someone else who had attacked Pro-Dommes and in fact their clients and got away with it. Definitely a case of YKINOK, yet it stays there, showing people that it's ok to slam not only the Pro-Dom/mes but those who go to them.
Sorry, this: http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/boards/mistress... post.
But it doesn't say "if you go to see Pro-Dommes you're stupid", it says "Some so called " Dommes " seem to think they can get away with charging Ł250 per hour, especially in London. Oh, and some sort of gift from their " wish list " on top. Frightening, really, but I guess that some people must be stupid enough to pay it."
ie that paying Ł250/hour is stupid
It's a bit like the threads about Coco de Mer claiming their prices are stupid.
Admin

Some people actually *like* paying more for things. Hence the old saying you get what you pay for. They consider it has added status because of it. Some people would rather pay the inflated prices at Coco de Mer to say they have bought something there, than go to CC&K and buy the same item for a lower sum. That's no reason to knock the people who do. For some it *is* a kink. And very little different from financial subbing.
Red
Happily ensconced with my true Master
Si Hoc Legere Scis Nimium Eruditionis Habes
Free Sessions in Bristol

11 Jun 08, 2:40 PM
Admin
UK, 11 yrs

x_Red_x wrote:

Admin wrote:

x_Red_x wrote:
On a further note, I mentioned this post, which is so blatantly "if you go to see Pro-Dommes you're stupid", and yet it still stands there. Someone else who had attacked Pro-Dommes and in fact their clients and got away with it. Definitely a case of YKINOK, yet it stays there, showing people that it's ok to slam not only the Pro-Dom/mes but those who go to them.
Sorry, this: http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/boards/mistress... post.
But it doesn't say "if you go to see Pro-Dommes you're stupid", it says "Some so called " Dommes " seem to think they can get away with charging Ł250 per hour, especially in London. Oh, and some sort of gift from their " wish list " on top. Frightening, really, but I guess that some people must be stupid enough to pay it."
ie that paying Ł250/hour is stupid
It's a bit like the threads about Coco de Mer claiming their prices are stupid.
Some people actually *like* paying more for things. Hence the old saying you get what you pay for. They consider it has added status because of it. Some people would rather pay the inflated prices at Coco de Mer to say they have bought something there, than go to CC&K and buy the same item for a lower sum. That's no reason to knock the people who do. For some it *is* a kink. And very little different from financial subbing.
He's not talking about that kink though is he? (He makes no reference to people liking paying those prices.)
None of these examples are very persuasive.
I agree that in total they present an anti-pro tone (which is why we offered to GOAB and lock duplicate threads if they happen), but other people on other areas of the site have to deal with negative feelings about their kinks.
If other posters are careful enough not to make downright YKINOK statements, then the ensuing disagreement and discomfort is the price we all pay for having discussions.
And it must be said, that some regulars on this board have a history of being manipulated by cool-headed trolls into violating the AUP with personal attacks
I would suggest sticking to the line that the market sets the price and ignore anyone trying to provoke an outburst by asking awkward questions.
Regards,
Admin
Remember: it's only a website

11 Jun 08, 2:45 PM
x_Red_x
UK(KT), 3 yrs

Admin wrote:

x_Red_x wrote:

Admin wrote:

x_Red_x wrote:
On a further note, I mentioned this post, which is so blatantly "if you go to see Pro-Dommes you're stupid", and yet it still stands there. Someone else who had attacked Pro-Dommes and in fact their clients and got away with it. Definitely a case of YKINOK, yet it stays there, showing people that it's ok to slam not only the Pro-Dom/mes but those who go to them.
Sorry, this: http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/boards/mistress... post.
But it doesn't say "if you go to see Pro-Dommes you're stupid", it says "Some so called " Dommes " seem to think they can get away with charging Ł250 per hour, especially in London. Oh, and some sort of gift from their " wish list " on top. Frightening, really, but I guess that some people must be stupid enough to pay it."
ie that paying Ł250/hour is stupid
It's a bit like the threads about Coco de Mer claiming their prices are stupid.
Some people actually *like* paying more for things. Hence the old saying you get what you pay for. They consider it has added status because of it. Some people would rather pay the inflated prices at Coco de Mer to say they have bought something there, than go to CC&K and buy the same item for a lower sum. That's no reason to knock the people who do. For some it *is* a kink. And very little different from financial subbing.
He's not talking about that kink though is he? (He makes no reference to people liking paying those prices.)
None of these examples are very persuasive.
I agree that in total they present an anti-pro tone (which is why we offered to GOAB and lock duplicate threads if they happen), but other people on other areas of the site have to deal with negative feelings about their kinks.
If other posters are careful enough not to make downright YKINOK statements, then the ensuing disagreement and discomfort is the price we all pay for having discussions.
And it must be said, that some regulars on this board have a history of being manipulated by cool-headed trolls into violating the AUP with personal attacks
I would suggest sticking to the line that the market sets the price and ignore anyone trying to provoke an outburst by asking awkward questions.
Regards,
Admin

You mean like this?: http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/boards/mistress...
I think the thread locking is a very positive move forward, and one that I certainly would welcome, and I would hope others, too. However, when we get someone who specifically comes back time and again having a pop, such as the guy you threw out in December, could we have a more positive action or statement from you that this kind of thing isn't on? I say this because after the first couple of posts it was clear that his aim was provocation, and pretty snide provocation at that, and yet you only banned him for sock puppetry, not for his carefully worded yet obvious and repeated attacks.
Red
Happily ensconced with my true Master
Si Hoc Legere Scis Nimium Eruditionis Habes
Free Sessions in Bristol

11 Jun 08, 2:54 PM
Admin
UK, 11 yrs

x_Red_x wrote:
I think the thread locking is a very positive move forward, and one that I certainly would welcome, and I would hope others, too. However, when we get someone who specifically comes back time and again having a pop, such as the guy you threw out in December, could we have a more positive action or statement from you that this kind of thing isn't on? I say this because after the first couple of posts it was clear that his aim was provocation, and pretty snide provocation at that, and yet you only banned him for sock puppetry, not for his carefully worded yet obvious and repeated attacks.
What if someone genuinely believes, for instance, that pro services are over priced and thinks he can change that by bringing it up once a month? Our "round the table" opinion is that it's meaningless to ask what a particular thing is "really" worth - it's only the market that gives money its value - but that's not the point: they think something else.
Since it's not at all obvious - to us at least - how malicious a particular poster's agenda is, what you're suggesting amounts to us suppressing a particular point of view.
Regards,
Admin
Remember: it's only a website

Edited 11 Jun 08, 2:55 PM by Admin

11 Jun 08, 3:05 PM
x_Red_x
UK(KT), 3 yrs

Admin wrote:

x_Red_x wrote:
I think the thread locking is a very positive move forward, and one that I certainly would welcome, and I would hope others, too. However, when we get someone who specifically comes back time and again having a pop, such as the guy you threw out in December, could we have a more positive action or statement from you that this kind of thing isn't on? I say this because after the first couple of posts it was clear that his aim was provocation, and pretty snide provocation at that, and yet you only banned him for sock puppetry, not for his carefully worded yet obvious and repeated attacks.
What if someone genuinely believes, for instance, that pro services are over priced and thinks he can change that by bringing it up once a month? Our "round the table" opinion is that it's meaningless to ask what a particular thing is "really" worth - it's only the market that gives money its value - but that's not the point: they think something else.
Since it's not at all obvious - to us at least - how malicious a particular poster's agenda is, what you're suggesting amounts to us suppressing a particular point of view.
Regards,
Admin

Ok, perhaps I failed to clarify things enough. If a poster says "why do pro-Dommes charge so much?" that's a fair point. If they say "it's unfair that pro-Dommes charge so much", then yes, they don't think it's fair, not a lot we can do about that. I don't think it's fair that I pay so much road tax, but there you go, life's unfair. If they say "I think it's wrong that pro-Dommes charge so much", then, again, it's the car tax argument. But when they say "Pro-Dommes charge so very much, I'm sure they must be suffering terribly under the upper bracket tax burden when new lingerie and bonbons cost a fortune", then it's obviously not just humour, it's not a pov, it's an attack. It certainly feels like one.

Red
Happily ensconced with my true Master
Si Hoc Legere Scis Nimium Eruditionis Habes
Free Sessions in Bristol

11 Jun 08, 3:25 PM
Mistress_Susannah
UK(SE), 3 yrs
£ Y!
I do agree with you Red to a certain extent - sometimes you feel like you're fighting a battle and I suppose the situation can sometimes feel a bit opressive if the majority of this forum is Dominated by threads such as that.
But at the same time I agree with Admin. It's unfair to moderate someone because of supposed intentions.
As far as I'm concerned it doesn't bother me in the slightest - yes sometimes it can get a little wearing - but I'm happy to explain my tributes - I think those who are new to things and would consider visiting a pro Domme but maybe put off by price can understand from our postings how much time, effort and dedication is put in and why our prices are how they are. Those who have a hidden agenda are usually revealed for how ridiculous their argument is and we usually come out on top as generous and gregarious with excellent senses of humour - that is if we don't allow ourselves to be "baited".....that's the clue to all of this, argue your point, stand your ground, but when things descend into personal attacks (even in retribution) that's when status is lost.
We have a responsibility for this forum too. With respect, threads like this make me want to scream - they make us come across as annoying harpies and we can do better than this.
http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/boards/mistress...
Perhaps the way to counterbalance this is to start some of our own threads to demonstrate to the community that we're experienced and capable professionals - I've got my thinking cap on as we speak!
Anyway - one suggestion that Admin may wish to consider to help to balance this forum a little. If someone is discovered to be a sock puppet - should a thread that they've started then perhaps be locked, or should their posts be deleted - I suppose that is a question for the whole site not just this forum. I'm aware that this would take time and may well be unfeasable - but if someone isn't prepared to post as "themselves", should their posts remain for all prosperity?
http://www.mistresssusannah.co.uk

11 Jun 08, 3:44 PM
x_Red_x
UK(KT), 3 yrs

Mistress_Susannah wrote:
I do agree with you Red to a certain extent - sometimes you feel like you're fighting a battle and I suppose the situation can sometimes feel a bit opressive if the majority of this forum is Dominated by threads such as that.
But at the same time I agree with Admin. It's unfair to moderate someone because of supposed intentions.
As far as I'm concerned it doesn't bother me in the slightest - yes sometimes it can get a little wearing - but I'm happy to explain my tributes - I think those who are new to things and would consider visiting a pro Domme but maybe put off by price can understand from our postings how much time, effort and dedication is put in and why our prices are how they are. Those who have a hidden agenda are usually revealed for how ridiculous their argument is and we usually come out on top as generous and gregarious with excellent senses of humour - that is if we don't allow ourselves to be "baited".....that's the clue to all of this, argue your point, stand your ground, but when things descend into personal attacks (even in retribution) that's when status is lost.
We have a responsibility for this forum too. With respect, threads like this make me want to scream - they make us come across as annoying harpies and we can do better than this.
http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/boards/mistress...
Perhaps the way to counterbalance this is to start some of our own threads to demonstrate to the community that we're experienced and capable professionals - I've got my thinking cap on as we speak!
Anyway - one suggestion that Admin may wish to consider to help to balance this forum a little. If someone is discovered to be a sock puppet - should a thread that they've started then perhaps be locked, or should their posts be deleted - I suppose that is a question for the whole site not just this forum. I'm aware that this would take time and may well be unfeasable - but if someone isn't prepared to post as "themselves", should their posts remain for all prosperity?
A very valid point. And yes, you're right, we do ourselves no favours at all when we descend to the level of harpies. I agree that malicious posts by a 2nd account or sock puppet posts should be deleted. Since the account shouldn't effectively be there in the first place, why should their posts be granted the opportunity to remain?
As for your thinking cap - perhaps Admin would allow the Pro-Domm/es to get together and create a write up, in agreement amongst ourselves, to forestall the inevitable why do you cost so much questions? Perhaps we could get a good writer who is better at words than some of us to put together our united front, so to speak, and to say *why* those costs are as they are. What they cover, what you can expect for your money. Not so much a code of conduct as a (God I hate this term) Mission Statement of what you should be able to expect and why it will cost you what it does. If all the Dom/mes agree it, and sign off on it, then it might be a good starting point where if someone posts "why", we can say *link*. It saves the arguing for a start!

Red
Happily ensconced with my true Master
Si Hoc Legere Scis Nimium Eruditionis Habes
Free Sessions in Bristol

11 Jun 08, 3:49 PM
x_Red_x
UK(KT), 3 yrs
Why do I get the feeling getting Pro-Dom/mes to agree on something is probably going to be like cat herding?
Red
Happily ensconced with my true Master
Si Hoc Legere Scis Nimium Eruditionis Habes
Free Sessions in Bristol

11 Jun 08, 3:50 PM
Jahc99
UK, 2 yrs

I agree it's a tricky one, there has to be freedom to disagree, ask questions and so on. And a lot of it does come down to tone, which is very difficult to define let alone moderate.
Some have a blatantly hostile intent, like the recent example, not surprised to learn there was real malice behind that. And I do recall reporting a certain 'character' to Admin for suggesting professional dommes should be lined up and shot like rats, or something like that. Why that guy hasn't been banned does baffle me, since he has openly threatened people with violence as well, has multiple profiles etc.
Then there are questions which are just designed to needle - not just because they are that kind of question, but because they come up time and again (so nice one on the GOABs, btw. Oddly enough, I don't mind the 'are there any male PDs out there?' GOABs tho.....).
I mean questions like: Charge too much, the damned prostitute/sex worker thing, rip offs, the threads on financial domination can be a nightmare, as can those reporting outtings (sad to hear of yet another today ) where one is effectively told it's fair game if you advertise, etc etc. There are tones of anti-attitudes in all, but they don't specifically break any part of the aup. But as soon as anyone defends, it tends to get personal, which was doubtless the intention from the off. And that's what makes the tone of here so bad sometimes and I am sure deters a lot from joining in.
It is just a fact that people seem to target PDs for the wind up routine, just as many make appointments without ever intending to turn up. I don't understand the psychology of that, but sense a similar intent behind some of the online wind ups as well.
Having said that, at times some of 'us' (self/selves included), have got too shirty too fast, perhaps, when you look again in the cold light of day. Not rising to the bait, and a strategy of humour may help introduce the sort of self moderation that makes the rest of the site work happen here more.
Funny really. Our principal weapon is fear, fear and surprise. Our two weapons are fear, surprise, and a Semi Trained Ape. Amongst our weapons are.....
OK, I'll fetch the comfy armchair.

11 Jun 08, 6:23 PM
Jahc99
UK, 2 yrs

PS: I believe we have a winner: http://www.informedconsent.co.uk/boards/mistress...
Joined in 2005, and that is the one and only post.....

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